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No more totally free scuba diving
#145947 05/18/2021 02:50 PM
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Just got Facebook post from Hedo.

Only 2 free dives per visit. Each additional dive now $65 each !!

WTF ?!?


Rosetta Stone Jamaican Edition !!!

http://bit.ly/1euljyZ
Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145948 05/18/2021 04:42 PM
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Dive shack is a new profit center. Maybe next up is a charge for premium liquor. Right now you get Grey Goose and Maker Mark
included, but pay for Red Bull.

Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145951 05/18/2021 05:46 PM
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Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.

Judy

Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145952 05/18/2021 07:35 PM
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So, the all inclusive concept continues to erode.

I remember when cigarettes and horse back riding were included.
And there was never a charge for drinks (except for champagne, as I recall). But now you can get champagne, so the erosion can reverse itself (sometimes).

Let's hope customer displeasure will make management rethink their actions.

Respect.


The more you look, the more you see.
Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145953 05/18/2021 07:45 PM
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I am trying to find out more information like, does the limit apply to guests already booked under the assumption that they were going to be able to dive more. And can people book consecutive 3-night (that is the minimum) stays to make up a longer stay and get 2 dives per "stay". I will post what I find out and include it in a newsletter.


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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145954 05/19/2021 05:35 AM
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On another platform, I read where the "backup boat" broke down at sea. Was this the snorkel boat or the rental that was being used the last day of our trip the first week of May?

Judy

Re: No more totally free scuba diving
DennyP #145955 05/19/2021 08:33 AM
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Resort management replied to my inquiry with ...
Quote
We are evaluating the changes and will advise.


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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
DennyP #145956 05/19/2021 08:45 AM
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In the meantime, write to complain:
HarryLange@Hedonism.com
Randymon@hedonism.com
dermotdeloughry@hedonism.com
camilleseaton@hedonism.com


Regards,
Chris
"The Naked Truth About Hedonism II" New 3rd edition!
at www.chrissantilli.com
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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
DennyP #145957 05/19/2021 08:46 AM
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Pretty goofy to trot out something like that....and THEN evaluate it. Clearly they don't know their guests after all.


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Chris
"The Naked Truth About Hedonism II" New 3rd edition!
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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145958 05/19/2021 09:40 AM
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The SCUBA change is scheduled to be effective Aug 1, 2022.

Their website and Facebook page will be updated.


Quotes & Reservations from DennyP Travel L.L.C. - https://www.dennyp.com/dennyptravel/quote_request.htm
Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145959 05/19/2021 11:21 AM
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So this also tells me they are not going to bother getting any sort of upgraded Dive Boat. Which with less than decent dive boat, and people not paying to dive more, there will be fewer divers. Leading to "Why should we bother having diving at all?" Then snorkelling will go Bye Bye, and as interest dwindles in kayaking, sailing etc, those will be goners too.

The new groups do not know what they are going to be missing. We learned to dive there just because we saw people diving!

Judy

Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145960 05/19/2021 11:34 AM
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For perspective:

+ Harry kept the place open and employed over 300 staff while several other hotels (larger and corporate funded) closed (i.e. Riu) - he told me he could have closed the place to save money but he didn't want to leave all those Jamaicans without an income.
+ Eliminated charges for the coffee bar

Yes, scuba was a big draw but impacts a small percentage of the total guest count; I'm not a diver and would probably have a different perspective if I was. I do know some of the longer-term guest divers took advantage of the program - and I'm as guilty as the rest for the services I use. This could be one of the reasons some of the longer-term staff (esp. senior ones) are no longer there - they allowed us to take advantage of them (at a cost to the hotel and / or other guests). Again, I'll confess to being as guilty as the rest. Note: there is not inside info in this statement, just my opinion.

So, as Mr. Dylan says: "Times they are a changin' "; but they changed when Negril Beach Village became Hedo; they changed when Hedo 3 closed and the large groups relocated to Hedo II; they changed when Harry and Co. took over. One of my philosophies: You either are always changing or you're always dying. Of course there's always and alternative: Marriott could buy it (like they're doing with the Royaltans on the island).

Respect all.

Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145961 05/19/2021 01:07 PM
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Glad it doesn't effect people who have already booked expecting scuba...but lots of folks will stop going b/c it will be gone in the future unless folks bitch enough (IMO).


Regards,
Chris
"The Naked Truth About Hedonism II" New 3rd edition!
at www.chrissantilli.com
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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
CharlieV. #145962 05/19/2021 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by CharlieV.
For perspective:

+ Harry kept the place open and employed over 300 staff while several other hotels (larger and corporate funded) closed (i.e. Riu) - he told me he could have closed the place to save money but he didn't want to leave all those Jamaicans without an income.
+ Eliminated charges for the coffee bar

Yes, scuba was a big draw but impacts a small percentage of the total guest count; I'm not a diver and would probably have a different perspective if I was. I do know some of the longer-term guest divers took advantage of the program - and I'm as guilty as the rest for the services I use. This could be one of the reasons some of the longer-term staff (esp. senior ones) are no longer there - they allowed us to take advantage of them (at a cost to the hotel and / or other guests). Again, I'll confess to being as guilty as the rest. Note: there is not inside info in this statement, just my opinion.

So, as Mr. Dylan says: "Times they are a changin' "; but they changed when Negril Beach Village became Hedo; they changed when Hedo 3 closed and the large groups relocated to Hedo II; they changed when Harry and Co. took over. One of my philosophies: You either are always changing or you're always dying. Of course there's always and alternative: Marriott could buy it (like they're doing with the Royaltans on the island).

Respect all.



Great perspective Charlie...........

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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145963 05/20/2021 08:25 AM
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Little by little, the continued erosion of what we get versus the higher price we pay...

Remember, even if you don't dive, you may want to consider supporting an important activity for many guests....the resort might come for your favorite thing next!

Over the years, (many things before Harry's ownership, but not all) already have taken away bus transport to/from MoBay, cigarettes, horseback riding, water skiing, circus equipment, lots of trees/flowers, water slide, ice sculptures, a piano bar that was way more participatory, the beloved 14/3 loyalty program, etc.)

Finally, though, we do have enough towels and hot water and two power generators--YES! Thank god!


Regards,
Chris
"The Naked Truth About Hedonism II" New 3rd edition!
at www.chrissantilli.com
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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145964 05/20/2021 09:52 AM
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>>Remember, even if you don't dive, you may want to consider supporting an important activity for many guests....the resort might come for your favorite thing next!<<

correct Chris. Next might be all of the rest of the watersports, weddings, tennis, restaurants, who knows what.

Judy

Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145965 05/20/2021 11:35 AM
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Just an observation.........

We collectively complained for a long time about the resort needing improvements.

I think Harry basically saved the resort when he bought it, rather than someone turning it into a family resort.

When Harry bought it, all the 'expert' guests lined up to give him LOTS of opinions on EVERYTHING that they wanted done. Harry used the collective judgement of his team, coupled with some of the guest input, and decided what changes to implement. Some among us were saying through all this process that we all should be careful for what we ask for, because it all costs money and Hedo is still a business.

After all the upgrades, the guest community had some who cheered and claimed it was a great thing, others still complained they wanted it done differently or wanted other changes that hadn't been incorporated.

About then, the rate changes and marketing started to change. Some really complained about the higher prices, that he was catering to large groups, that he was catering to young people, that he was catering too much to lifestyle people ect.

He's now coming out of a huge financial challenge since the beginning of last year with closure and low occupancy rates due to COVID.

It's logical now would be a good time for them to consider cost cutting measures to help them recoup from the financial strain on the resort since early last year.


Are we grateful he kept our favorite place alive??

Are we grateful that not ALL of our favorite people lost their jobs?

Are we grateful we can still go enjoy the place we love, perhaps with some compromises??


Maybe folks should think about that............. just my opinion, yours may differ.

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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145966 05/20/2021 11:57 AM
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I think the compromise that is being offered is too great. Many of us never asked for TVs, phones, high-end booze, fancy rooms, coffee bar, etc. We WERE thrilled with hot water and lots of towels...YAY!

I think a compromise of less impact would be fine--perhaps keep dive program as is with ONE dive per day included, but those who want a second dive--when there's room on the boat (sometimes there isn't)--could pay a fee for the tank (and that way pay for all the extra staffing/wear&tear on the boat, etc).


Regards,
Chris
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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
chris santilli #145967 05/20/2021 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by chris santilli
I think the compromise that is being offered is too great. Many of us never asked for TVs, phones, high-end booze, fancy rooms, coffee bar, etc. We WERE thrilled with hot water and lots of towels...YAY!

I think a compromise of less impact would be fine--perhaps keep dive program as is with ONE dive per day included, but those who want a second dive--when there's room on the boat (sometimes there isn't)--could pay a fee for the tank (and that way pay for all the extra staffing/wear&tear on the boat, etc).


Yeah, I didn't ask for all the upgrades either and would prefer more affordable rates so I could spend more time there rather than paying higher rates for stuff I didn't care about, but I that's just my opinion.

There are always lots of 'experts' and people with strong opinions when it's not THEIR money invested in the resort and it's not THEIR business to run. Remember this is Harry's retirement plan, so he's got a BIG interest in making it successful and being happy with the decisions HE gets to make.


It's his playground and we get to enjoy it for whatever it is, or decide to take our money and go elsewhere.

Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145969 05/20/2021 06:46 PM
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Ok then, would people feel better about paying for diving if the money went into a better dive boat?

I miss the old Superclubs airport waiting lounge - but for the amount of time I actually used it I can live without it.

Whatever. It's too soon to judge, lets wait until Covid has run it's course.


All in all, I'd rather be a hippy.
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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145970 05/21/2021 04:48 AM
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I would not feel better about paying for something that used to be included to pay for a new dive boat. Sandals and Couples have much better dive boats and there is no charge.

Would anyone feel better about paying for one of the shady spots in the pool? Included now, but they have to pay for those nice new umbrellas somehow. Or what about those nice tables and chairs by the grill? $10 per half hour sounds fair. How about the beach loungers that are so plentiful now? Only allowed to plunk your butt in one twice per stay or else! Hmmm, you could be allowed only one beach towel per stay or pay up bucko. I can see a turnstile with a credit card swiper installed on the hot tub soon. The playroom? Ticket system, you get two free partners per stay, after that, better bring cash, although I don't know where you would store it....hmmm maybe better charge that to your room.

The list goes on and on.

Judy

Re: No more totally free scuba diving
LyleM #145971 05/21/2021 07:15 AM
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"It's his playground and we get to enjoy it for whatever it is, or decide to take our money and go elsewhere."

Tru dat Lyle!

I doubt any of the meaningful changes at the hotel happy without Harry's approval and / or at his direction. And, we're all guests - not owners. Like I tell folks on the beach, I just pay rent and go with the flow. When it no longer works for me, I'll move on. The hotel will survive and so will I.

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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145972 05/21/2021 07:27 AM
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I concur Charlie. We, Cyn and I, will eventually move on, not because of any changes at the resort, but rather because none of us escapes gravity. However...not yet! ;-)


"It has been my experience that folks who have no vices...have very few virtues." Abraham Lincoln
Re: No more totally free scuba diving
repeatoffender4th #145973 05/21/2021 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by repeatoffender4th
Would anyone feel better about paying for one of the shady spots in the pool? Included now, but they have to pay for those nice new umbrellas somehow.

OK, point taken. It could be the start of a slippery slope. I've been to a Mexican all inclusive where you had to pay extra for a maddening list of "perks" - it got very annoying very fast. Better to include everything in the room price, and be up front about it.


All in all, I'd rather be a hippy.
Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145974 05/21/2021 10:49 AM
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Yes, of course, Harry and his mgmt team will do what they think is best. And yes, I think Harry and his mgmt team also listens to guests. I'm just a guest--among many--who I'd like him to listen to. I don't expect Hedo to do things my way, but if I quietly just take what I see as bad changes, then I'm part of the problem. That's my take.


Regards,
Chris
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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
chris santilli #145975 05/21/2021 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by chris santilli
Yes, of course, Harry and his mgmt team will do what they think is best. And yes, I think Harry and his mgmt team also listens to guests. I'm just a guest--among many--who I'd like him to listen to. I don't expect Hedo to do things my way, but if I quietly just take what I see as bad changes, then I'm part of the problem. That's my take.


Do you pass your input directly to Harry?

Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145976 05/21/2021 01:33 PM
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Yes, I email Harry my thoughts...and have done so in the past too. I don't yet have a relationship with the Dermot, so I don't write him.


Regards,
Chris
"The Naked Truth About Hedonism II" New 3rd edition!
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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145977 05/21/2021 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Doug
Just got Facebook post from Hedo.

Only 2 free dives per visit. Each additional dive now $65 each !!

WTF ?!?
I see the latest update from Hedo (likely thanks to messages to Harry) is that the changes will definitely not take place until August 2022 and after two free dives, additional dives will be $49 NOT $65 ( Desire charges $60).


"Your clothes conceal much of your beauty, yet they hide not the unbeautiful...meet the sun and the wind with more of your skin...For the breath of life is the sunlight and the hand of life is the wind ....". Kahlil Gibran
Re: No more totally free scuba diving
chris santilli #145978 05/21/2021 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by chris santilli
Yes, I email Harry my thoughts...and have done so in the past too. I don't yet have a relationship with the Dermot, so I don't write him.



That's good. A lot of people think it's sufficient to just complain bitterly on here and elsewhere in social media without actually talking with anyone in management about their complaints.

Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Lucie73 #145979 05/22/2021 10:21 AM
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Lucie, I still think that's absurd....I'll be writing Harry again.


Regards,
Chris
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Re: No more totally free scuba diving
Doug #145980 05/22/2021 04:33 PM
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For me, diving is not the only reason I return, but's a significant contributing factor in me returning.

At other places I've had to pay for diving –– the diving is MUCH better, and so is the boat.

For me it's not so much charging or not charging, or even how much -- it's with the messed up math the resort keeps using.

With the 14/3 program, at least the 3 nights were in the same category as the other 14 -- while the $700 for 12 incentivizes booking the cheapest rooms.

The repeaters party counts "stays" vs "nights" -- so a "2 night stay" is counted the same as "a 21 night stay".

While I understand that the "paid" diving details are still very much a work in progress and will probably change before being "finalized" -- if it's 2 included dives per "stay", that's similarly messed up. Should at least be x dives per y nights.

I don't pay per stay -- I pay per night.

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